Jen again...
I'll admit I continue to contribute there, however, and every once in a while someone puts up something truthful that actually brings the funny. The title of this entry quotes a thread started by DU member, Rabrrrrr, which, though I'm pretty sure s/he was attempting sarcasm, aptly captures an attitude I've been encountering all too frequently of late, among ostensibly sane citizens.
I've run into it before, of course, in both the equally desperate '04 and '06 elections—the "I'm so disturbed by the state of general corruption throughout the world that I won't vote at all" schtick that veritably curdles the brain with its absolutist defeatism. But I still just—I can't believe there is anyone left who can claim his apathy is severe enough it prevents him from participating.
My question for readers is this: am I the only person having run-ins with people threatening not to vote? As we move closer to November, how much do the apathetic scare you? Could or should any effort be made to reach these last improbable hold-outs?
11 comments:
IMO Jen, they're either Republican operatives trying to drive down the Dem vote, or PP's and you can't talk any sense into them anyhow.
Fagetaboutit.
Flo
Actually, I'm starting to think this works both ways.
Tonight on a radio show, a caller identified himself as a "middle of the road independent," unaffiliated with either party. Nevertheless, he said he and his wife supported Romney because he was more "middle of the road."
Now that Romney was out, the caller declared that he could not possibly support McCain because "his issues are too far to the left, and we're more middle of the road." Barack and Hillary were, of course, right out.
This, from a guy who says he's not a Republican.
I guess the roads are different in his part of the country.
At any rate, the hard-core prog-nonsense -- the "Kucinich or nothing!" crowd -- seems to be less of a factor on DU and some other progblogs. I wonder if the hard-core con-nonsense will continue to be a factor on the Republican side, or will they reconcile themselves to their candidate?
I think it comes down to the fact that no one feels proud having to vote for what they perceive as the lesser of two evils. I think Americans really do view their vote as sacred and to "throw it away" sickens a lot of them.
Voting is like deciding to add a brick to a dam rather than adding a bucket of water to the flood when you really feel like putting in a vote to raise the land instead or to stop the source of the flood. It seems like the wrong plan, but I understand that without more bricks for the dam, the more ambitious plans will never get off the ground.
I would sincerely like to thank the good dr. elsewhere for something he/she (? what is it?) wrote a few days about about voting. You convinced me to vote Democratic no mater what this year. Your agruments made sense. Thank you.
.R.S.E.
wow, rse; thanks for the kind words! i'd never dream anything i ever say here gets taken that seriously (as we are all on some level just wankin' the best we can, no?), tho on the other hand, i take what joe and jen and antifascist say pretty seriously. so there you go.
in any case, in response to your metaphor, i agree that folks take their votes quite seriously, and well they should. but the point i was making about all those folks who refuse to cast their votes for anyone but THEIR guy, THEIR perfect candidate, they really are taking on a position as indefensible as those fundamentalist rightwingnuts. THAT is cult-think if ever there was such, regardless of the symbolic candidate fronting it.
in a democracy, for all its current US flaws re: campaigns and media influence and money, etc., is ALWAYS about compromise. today your fave is not on top, but next time, who knows? in the meantime, IN A DEMOCRACY, we've all essentially "signed" (read: got born or nationalized) on to this process, which means in the end that we defer to the majority, and then work to shift that majority to what we feel are better goals in the future.
it's a much slower process than a dictatorship, as the W is quick to lament. all i can say to those who refuse to vote for anyone but their fave rock star is that they are NOT participating in this democracy, it insults the rest of us with differing opinions, and diminishes the chances that the system will move - however sluggishly - even in the general direction they would prefer.
hence my lambasting mr. nader.
anyway, glad you voted and plan to continue to do so, rse; this democracy needs you and more like you!
ps. i'm a she. for what that's worth.
I haven't run into this in Canada, although with four parties in the House of Commons and the Greens knocking at the door, there's a wingnut for nearly everyone's taste.
(It's the beauty of a parliamentary democracy. You have to win a majority of the 301 ridings (constituencies) accross the country or you ain't the head of government, no matter how much money you got. And if your neighbours think you're a jerk, your party can win in a landslide and you still ain't there because you lost your own riding. Dang, I love this country.)
But I recently had a woman tell me that after thirty years in Canada she has never taken out citizenship and she will not until "Canada does something that makes me really proud." She's from South Africa.
She's a dear soul, really, but JEEBUS! I'm not sure how one is supposed to react to that without invoking several of the more interesting provisions of the Criminal Code.
Jim
the thoughtful reader
Almost invariably, the threats of situational apathy I'm hearing this season are coming from the Obamabots. There's this tendency in that camp to threaten to take their ball and go home if their candidate doesn't win. Not since Nader 2000 have I been so frustrated and infuriated so often by that type of attitude.
In fact, right after reading the above post-- on which I didn't originally intend to comment-- I encountered multiples instances just in the course of my morning. First, the very next site I clicked on, I stumbled into a nest of Obama cult, my-candidate-or-the-highway commentary in response to a posting about robocalls in WA state (wherein a number of commenters baselessly jump to the conclusion that the robocalls were being placed by the Clinton camp and therefore this underscored why they were never going to vote for the evil that is the Clintons, or something). Specifically, this post and its comments here: http://preview.tinyurl.com/2ayfmp
Then, I'm overhearing some coworkers taking off to go to an Obama rally today, and no less than three of them agreed that if their man Obama didn't get the nomination then they'd just as soon vote for McCain. "Or my dog," said one of them. And these are Democrats.
Would the Obama die-hards refuse to vote even for a Clinton/Obama ticket?
The apathetic ones probably believe health care grows on trees.
So far, the Democratic voter turnout has been promising, no? After the conventions, there'll be less to be apathetic about. Geez, I hope Nader isn't the only candidate who tells the truth about the vote-rigging investigations and conclusions. I mean, RFK, Jr put the 2004 Ohio vote-rigging evidence on the front pages, and he endorsed Senator Clinton early. If she never mentions it I still love her.
If I think the voting machines will be rigged and would flip my Democratic vote, I might be justified in being apathetic. So, if I stay home instead of voting for the Democrat, it's one less vote for the Republican. Go ahead, prove me wrong and make my day.
aitchd, you surprise me; you're usually more creative than this.
if you're so worried about your vote in november, arrange to be out of town and do an absentee ballot.
at least it's paper and can't be flipped and can be counted.
Dr. Elsewhere,
don't you remember how many absentee ballots got tossed during Florida's Nov 2000 election? Many of the overseas ballots got "lost".
Sending in an absentee ballot by snail mail is amongst one of the most vulnerable ways of voting because it is so easy for it to get "lost" or to get "spoiled" in transit.
Besides, in several states like New Mexico, many people who requested an absentee ballot a month in advance never got one. Then they showed up at the polling place and couldn't find their name on the voter reg roll.
The $64,000 question is: Do the Powers That Be prefer Hilary or McCain in office?
my guess is that it will be McCain. by propping up Hilary who really would have come in 3rd place if the evoting systems were counting the votes correctly, she is one of the weakest candidates and many many many Repubs and dems can't stand her.
Just a little over a year ago, Joseph Cannonfire featured a funny youtube video about 3 British guys for the BBC America show, "Top Gear", in which they came to the US, bought cheap cars in Florida and then drove across the South to sell them (or give them away) in New Orleans.
Along their journey, they played a prank by painting slogans on the sides of their cars such as NASCAR sucks, Hilary for President, Man-Love rules and then driving in Alabama highways. When they stopped at a gas station to get gas, they got in trouble with the owner of the gas station who called "the boys". "the boys" showed up within a few minutes while they were still getting gas and they started throwing large rocks at the cameramen, their cars and chasing them with baseball bats and other large sticks.
You could see them sweat bigtime when one of the used cars wouldn't start and they had to jumpstart it.
Now fast forward another 18 months, nothing much has changed in the South while Hilary is running now.
anon, i don't know how the absentee ballots work where you are, but here in MA, whenever i've had to be away for an election, i've simply driven to the city hall, requested an absentee ballot, and filled it in right there, and handed it to the clerk. done. sealed and signed over the seal, etc.
of course, i have no real way of knowing what happened to it after that, but here in MA, these things are taken very seriously, and it's just second nature to preserve the voters' votes.
in fact, i recently moved and forgot to register in my new town. i realized my error the day after the deadline prior to the primary, and called to find out what i could do. the clerk was nonplussed; no problem she said. if you haven't changed your registration yet, then you should still be registered in your previous location and can still vote there. i was nearly incredulous, given the stories i've heard about in GA and AL, etc.; they'll let me do that, i asked.
of course, she said, more incredulous than i was. they're not going to deny you your right to vote.
big diff between new england, the birthplace of our democracy, and the deep south, where insistence on maintaining slave labor without granting the vote to slaves led to the 'great' compromise that brought us the senate and the electoral college and essentially UNequal representation in our 'representative' republic.
having lived in the deep south most of my life, i can tell you it's like another universe down there. which is why i will NEVER live there again.
but for those who do, i highly encourage you to get really really active in your local democratic party, and run for local offices, like the city or county councils and school boards, etc. more importantly, VOLUNTEER TO WORK THE POLLS ON ELECTION DAY. this way a reasonable eye can be kept on things, and you get your foot in the door on implementing changes where needed.
and of course, lobby like hell against voter id, etc. it'll be interesting to see what the SCOTUS will do with that case. if they rule in favor of the states' rights to impose this thinly veiled poll tax, it'll serve as yet another signal of the demise of our democracy.
Not all non-voters are created equal. While you describe the disenfranchised non-voter as apathetic, I would argue the same is true for you, that you now believe that anyone with any amount of power gives two shits about what you want. That, is an unhealthy indifference.
I am constantly confronted with the "if you don't vote, don't bitch" mentality. And to that I would counter that your endorsement of a system which is severely flawed, is tantamount to leaving your fingerprints all over the crime scene.
Well, I guess we'll find you curled up in the fetal position hanging on to your "i voted" sticker while the real leg work is getting done by those, like myself, who realize that voting is not really an effective form of direct action (Double-hearing protection required). At least not in the current environment.
You're playing checkers. They're playing chess.
-sig Mentor
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