So...I, uh...I have a question about the person depicted in this ad. Is that supposed to be the face of Barack Obama? Or is that supposed to be a representation of your typical American mom?If the latter, I'm pretty sure I don't want to move to Alabama. Do all the women there look like Alan Moore?
You know what's really funny? The idea that anyone going to college these days will be able to pay back all those loans. You didn't really think a Pell grant would cover costs, did you? These days, a Pell grant covers lunch money.
By the way: Just when did Obama ask "moms" to return to school?
This ad may be for one of the for-profit schools discussed here.
What the public might also have missed in the collage of economic downturns and dire prognostications has been the incredible fraud in the federal student loan programs tied to for-profit colleges and universities. Also what is under-reported are the student pay-day loan practices of private banks (bailed-out with stimulus monies and flush with cash) that charge high interest rates and in most cases require co-signers for students to attend these same institutions. Most notoriously, however, what is missing is coverage of the unscrupulous practices of the proprietary colleges, or for-profit colleges, that financially mug students, largely from working and low income families, leaving them burdened and battered with life-long debt in an economy and society bereft of jobs and largely becoming increasingly more militarized.
9 comments:
No offense to the dude in the photo, don't know anything about him, my impression of the photo is that it looks like a mug-shot.
Here's what FAFSA says about assessing student loans:
Under Federal law your family is primarily responsible - to the extent they are able - for paying for your college expenses. To determine how much your family can afford to pay towards your college expenses, we must collect your financial information and if you are a dependent student, we must also collect your parents' financial information.
As Market Ticker says:
At the age of 18 you are a legal adult, entitled to all of the rights and privileges thereupon... Your right to travel, live as you wish, and determine the path of your own life is unrestricted irrespective of your parents' wishes, as a matter of The Constitution. This does not (and should not) prevent your parents from contributing, on their own volition, to a young adult's education but it most certainly must prohibit the rubric of mandatory "contributions" to someone who is, under The Constitution, Federal and State law, a legal adult with all rights, duties and privileges that attach...There is in fact no federal law that states that a parent is required to pay for their child's college education...The parents of a student are in fact under no legal obligation to provide any information requested. Of course the government isn't obligated to provide you with "free money" (really, money they stole from a taxpayer at gunpoint) either!
There are some schools and departments whose standards and services are probably worth the price, depending on what you want to study. The rest are diploma mills that probably won't really give you much of value. If the school doesn't give you a real foot in the door to employment, research, or artistic opportunities, then what's the point?
Lots of women develop a little facial hair. Most of them use depilatories or bleaches, but there's nothing wrong with au naturale.
Now pucker up and give mom a big kiss.
"By the way: Just when did Obama ask "moms" to return to school?"
Obama has given a speech on every angle to every subject, so I'm thinking he both "asked moms to return to school" AND "asked moms not to return to school". Against FISA...for FISA...Anti-War Candidate"..."who we gonn'a invade today Candidate...he's got speeches for both, just go into the studio and give a reading mixed with crowd noises Tah-Dah...and even when he's caught out, his fans just scream louder for him.
For the record, I do believe Obama has been caught lying more than any other President in US History...and he hasn't even completed one year!
These are all over the Internet. I frequent the LOL type sites, and they are real frequent.
I've never seen that particular picture, which really isn't conducive to luring women to your product.
And the reason it states "Alabama", is because its the first state listed alphabetically.
I saw that same ad somewhere recently. And likewise found it odd enough to look it over a bit. Which might be the entire point of the odd juxtapositions of jarring elements. Marketing research on triggers. The applied science on the battle for eyeballs advances apace, because of the money involved. Made us look, just sayin'.
Pell grants are not so ineffective as you say. The maximum annual figure is $5,350. It is not a loan requiring repayment. Applying for the Pell grant automatically applies for all other federal and state and some institutional financial aid programs, including both grants and subsidized loan programs.
Over 50% of college students attending 4-year public colleges pay under $10,000 a year in tuition. 2-year junior colleges can charge as much as 50% less.*
Evidently then, someone could attend 2 years of community college for an AA degree at no tuition cost, and then finish a bachelor's degree with 2 years at a 4-year program with half-payment of a $10,000 tuition, borrowing $5,000 for two years, finishing owing $10,000.
This is perhaps a best case scenario, but however discounted, it is far more than lunch money.
XI
*http://www.ehow.com/about_4604578_what-average-college-tuition.html
XI said: "Evidently then, someone could attend 2 years of community college for an AA degree at no tuition cost, and then finish a bachelor's degree with 2 years at a 4-year program with half-payment of a $10,000 tuition, borrowing $5,000 for two years, finishing owing $10,000."
Unfortunately, it doesn't typically work that way. If you are not receiving any support from parents (and are either over 24, emancipated, a veteran, married, or are a parent), you still have to factor in living expenses. I don't know a whole lot of people who can juggle both a full time job as well as full time education (not to mention that you would have to have your employer work around class schedules each term - and that mostly means minimum wage type of jobs that are going to be able to do that, and if you need to work 40 hours, then it's probably multiple part time jobs). If you do work, then the money you make counts against any award amount you get. They estimate how much you will make while in school based on your last income tax filing (you can appeal if you can prove that your income will be decreased while in school). If you are married, then the amount that your spouse makes counts against the award amount you get (and yes, that can include the Pell Grant), though if you have children, you'll tend to get awarded more - but you'll have even less time for work and school with a child. A full time vs. part time school schedule is also figured into the amount of the grant/loans awarded. While the situation you described is certainly a nice goal to shoot for, I think it's not very realistic, especially when you factor in other school expenses (like books) which can easily be over $1000 a year. I will agree, though, that $5400 a year towards education costs that you don't have to pay back isn't chump change, and is highly valued by those going to university.
The topic that wxyz brought up is something that has irritated me for quite a while. As someone whose family made enough money to disqualify me for loans and grants for education before I hit 24 (but refused to help pay for my education), I found it quite hypocritical that the government, on one hand, said that my family didn't have to support me (including education) because I had become an adult, but that the government also expected my family to contribute to my education unless I emancipated myself, got married, joined the military, or had a kid. By the time I was investigating this, I was 23, and not too far away from 24, so for me, it wasn't too hard to wait until I was 24 to apply for aid, but I can't imagine what I would have done if I had needed loans and grants for school before then.
You're right, Kyre. The only cost I detail is tuition, leaving aside books and room and board. ]
There's some question about room and board considerations, given that, in or out of school, food and shelter are still requirements and would have to be paid/handled in some way or another.
But sure. In many regards there's a rosey scenario at play in the best case situation. But as you acknowledge, and I tried to point out, the subsidies are not inconsequential or de minimus.
In my case, I guess before Pell grants existed, my father refused to disclose anything to the school, my mother was unable to contribute anything (3 other children), the school gave me $8,500 (iirc, about half the tuition) and I had to borrow the rest. Then pops kicked in a thousand or two for expenses and walking around money.
A much better situation than most, but I still felt broke and behind a considerable debt.
XI
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