Thursday, September 29, 2011

Occupy Wall Street

The "Occupy Wall Street" movement is morphing into a nationwide movement called "Occupy Together." (Stupid name, but let's not quibble about nomenclature.) Why haven't I mentioned the protests in New York heretofore? Because I am unsure if any good can come of them. There is no leadership. There is no platform. There are no specific goals. No demands. No coherent weltanschauung.

Perhaps worst of all, this movement is primarily the work of young people -- in other words, of idiots. They have no sense of history, no idea as to which past strategies have worked and which have failed. Never trust anyone under 30.

Naturally, these fetuses are reliant on Facebook and Twitter and cell phones with GPS -- which means that Uncle is keeping track of their every blink, breath and cough, as they keep feeding more and more info to the data-miners. This is a revolution? The first job of a revolutionary is to get away with it -- and you'll never get away with it if you don't know when to maintain radio silence. (Or computer and cell phone silence.)

As I said: These toddlers are idiots. Never forget that we're dealing with the same college kids who thought that Obama was the Prog Messiah.

If the current movement proves to be a genuine threat to the powers-that-be, here's what will happen:

1. The provocateurs will show up. Agents will commit acts of violence, thereby giving the entire movement a black eye.

2. A glib and charismatic YAFL (Yet Another Fucking Libertarian) will commandeer the movement, or at least a large section thereof.

3. An avowed Marxist (either a phony or a manipulated dupe) will become one of the faces of the movement. This will scare the folks in the heartland and play right into the Randroid propaganda line.

4. The entire shebang will be undone by internal bickering, combating egos, the unrelenting cries of me me me. Most of all, expect to see that unrelenting scourge of liberalism: Identity politics. (Black, gay, Hispanic, feminist, etc.) Once those egomaniacs take the spotlight -- it's over.

Lookee here and you will see that other scourge of the left -- the hopeless fantasy called "consensus decision making," otherwise known as Egomania On Parade. Ah yes. Let's have a return to the wonderful early days of the SDS, when the fetuses of 1963 spent eight hours debating whether to take half the day off.

I predict that nothing good will come of such an amorphous movement. If you want to see what these youngsters are doing wrong, take a gander at this recent message on the OccupyWallStreet site:
You must organize massive strikes. Marching is not enough. In a Capitalist society only striking will bring genuine change.

1) Organize strikes throughout the entire city: businesses and trades of every kind. Have them each designate a specific color to represent themselves.

2) Congregate all striking organizations in one place.
And on and on. What's missing here? For one thing: A program. Specific demands. A strike without demands makes about as much sense as a strike without representative negotiators.

The other thing missing here is, of course, any practical notion of how to get such an ambitious scheme off the ground. I'm reminded of the People's Front of Judea calling for the overthrow of the entire Roman empire within the next twelve months: "Yeah, twelve months. And let's face it: As empires go, this is the big one..."

From the same site, here's a "Message to the critics, the curious, the skeptics, and the purpose seekers."
"We Americans here-by assert our duty to alter our current form of government."
Alter it in what ways? The writer gives no specifics. How can we be sure that the writer would alter it for the better? (I'm already unhappy with the altered spelling of hereby.)

Look, fetuses: We oldsters can recall what happened to the anti-Vietnam movement. You can learn from us. Here's what went wrong in the 1970s: The motto "Don't trust the Pentagon" turned into "Don't trust the government" which turned into "Don't trust the very idea of government," which turned into "Vote for Reagan." Something very similar will happen here. Watch and see.

If you don't want to see that inevitable ideological segue -- call it "Creeping Libertarian Rot" -- you must state out loud: "We believe in a strong government and a new New Deal. In the economic sphere, we are 100% opposed to Libertarianism." I don't see that declaration in any of the "Occupy" web sites.

Do you seek "to alter our current form of government" via a Constitutional convention, as some misguided lefties do? Guess what: The Libertarians have their shit together on that front -- have had, for years -- and they are just dying for a convention to happen. They have the money, they have the numbers, they have the passion, they have the organizational skills, and most of all, they have the willingness to submit to an organizing body (which lefties are too egomaniacal to do). If there's a convention, they'll take over the place pronto. The result will be no Social Security, no Medicare, no EPA, no Pell Grants, no Middle Class, no impediments to Total Corporate Control. Welcome to Ayn RandLand.

How can the current "Occupy Wall Street" movement be transformed into something useful? Here's one modest proposal: No fetuses. We must have sufficient humility to admit that our educational system has failed. Therefore, no-one under the age of 30 should be allowed to write anything or to make any decisions. Even those over 30 must not be allowed a voice unless (for example) they can, without hesitation and without consulting Google, tell people who Robert La Folette was.

Beyond that, and more seriously: There must be leadership, there must be willingness to take direction from that leadership, there must be a program, there must be a specific set of grievances, and there must be a specific vision for the future. We also need a plan to combat predictable problems such as paranoia, smears, the sowing of internal strife, and acts by agents provocateurs.

Arguably, there is room for a brand new "ism" here. That may sound like odd advice, coming from the guy who once said that "all isms are prisons." But sweeping generalizations exist to be pissed on, right?

Without a plan of action and a concrete vision, all you'll ever have are crybabies crying. On teevee this morning, I heard Matt Taibbi and Keith Olbermann argue that, although the occupation may be vague and hazy now, it will probably coalesce into a movement with specific goals. Don't bet on it. Do you really think that a headless body can spontaneously generate a brain?

Feel free to offer your own suggestions.
Comments:
Well, this is a point where we disagree. I think the 99ers have a shot at raising awareness and waking people up. Yes, they're young for the most part and disorganized. But I wouldn't piss on the parade for that alone. And this act of civil disobedience has spread to Boston, Chicago, Las Vegas and out on the coast. The Nurses' Union has been pushing its own movement against the excesses of Wall St. The postal workers, the teachers' union and others are supportive. Reportedly buses came in from Wisconsin last weekend to stand shoulder-to-shoulder with the fetuses.

It's a beginning and will be followed by the movement/sit-in scheduled for DC in early October. The longer and larger these acts of dissent go on, the harder it will be to ignore.

Will it be successful? Who knows. I'm not a fortune teller. But sitting on our hands, moaning and groaning won't change a damn thing. Nor will elections.

I'm encouraged by this and several other pushes: Eric Schniederman, the AG in NY pushing forward with his investigations despite intimidation from the banks and the Administration; Dylan Ratigan's movement to GetTheMoneyOut; and yes, even the growing [if incredibly slow] acknowledgement that Obama is a fraud, bought and sold by those who brung 'im to the dance.

It has to start somewhere. Or it won't start at all. Color me encouraged by anyone willing to standup and pushback. Even fetuses!

Peggy Sue
 
Corporate America has made it so it's too risky for Joe and Jane Sixpack to go on strike like happens in Europe. There your medical benefits aren't tied to your employment and there is a safety net for the un/under employed.

When a Canadian acquaintance lost their job due to the slow down in American auto manufacturing he was bemoaning the loss of his health insurance. Turns out he was referring to his employer paid Vision and Dental plans. His health insurance is managed by the provincial government.

Anyway for a strike to be effective it has to bring commerce to a halt and that ain't gonna happen.
 
Its an evolutionary process. The enviroment is generating resistance. I do feel sorry for these kids. They can see their parents lifestyle being taken away from them. They dont understand why or how or how to resist. So they will get their butts kicked. But some of them will escape the dragnets and the kickings from Long Island policemen, and will go away having learned something about the true state of affairs and how things are done. They will learn and adapt. Expect facebook use to disappear and be replaced by pop up bulletin boards. Expect them to video everything so that if they are beaten videos get youtubed round the world in seconds. Its gonna be a long fight. I KNOW with absolute certainty that the kids are gonna win in the end (they always do). However it might well be entirely pyrrhic.

Harry
 
I'm afraid I agree with Peggy Sue. However, I think you make very good points Joseph. Still, it has to start somewhere, and established liberal institutions are obviously not doing a damn thing. I view this with skepticism, but also with a small amount of hope (not the Obama kind, of course).

As much as I think you're analysis is the most likely, I would prefer to focus on Peggy Sue's view.

However, I am not naive, and will be following this closely.

One thing is certain, elections will not change the situation we are in.
 
I agree with Peggy Sue. Obviously, all the same issues that applied to and often undermined the protests during the start-up protests against the Vietnam war will find their way into this movement. Still I believe these young people have focused on the correct culprits and are doing what all of us older folks wish we could do and no longer have the stamina to do. It's an "I'm pissed off and I won't take it anymore" movement & moment. Are they naive in their approach, in their methods, in their organization, in their vague goals, undoubtedly, but so were those of us who protested against the Vietnam war. All most of us knew was that our friends were being dragged off to a war that we didn't understand, in a country many of us knew absolutely nothing about. All we knew was that most of them were sent away against their will and many of them never came back. It was the elite using the people as cannon fodder to execute their own self serving agenda and strategic goals. It's fundamentally the same struggle, the powerless against the powerful.
 
Good tactical advice.

I haven't been able to parse out any real goal for these demonstrations. I have to agree that I hear no coherent strategy or alternative being offered. Looks a lot like G20 anarchists to me. They must be preaching to their choir. They've already exhausted their 15 minutes of notoriety, and the longer they go on, the more the consensus will turn on them. Time to declare victory and withdraw.

I think media coverage has been deliberately thin as a favor to the current Administration's hopes of re-election. Nothing pisses off a big chunk of America faster than seeing civil unrest, and the political ruling class gets the heat.
 
you hit it right on the head. I disagree that the sit in is useless, but agree, and am stunned by the answers when asked by the media what your goal is- "ummmm we are just here to uhhhmmm".
I would volunteer to be a spokesman- here is the answer: To hold those accountable for the meltdown.
To demand true government representation. Effective government that regulates. That the debt issue is used for profit and to rip appart any social net. That the debt issue can be resolved by- requiring the very banks we helped to contribute, reduce military spending without cutting veteran benefits, bring back industry so that unskilled workers can have jobs, if they do not bring back industry- to tax the imports that have US or other brand names such as GAP or Nike, or you name it. There should be serious tariffs since this has taken away jobs. Require current employers to provide benefits whether it is full time or part time- ie stop the Wall Mart scam. In France you get a work contract and automatic health coverage even if you are low wage- you can at least have health care.
Stop the monopolies and chains that have replaced small business. Stop the Bank-Oil-Defense industry control and propaganda and invest in new energy sources, or at the very least- creat ultra efficient vehicles- such as those in europe- they would sell.
There are just a few reasons why people are fed up and standing in the rain on Wall St in the rain, and spending the night- This is a great post/blog and I agree- this BS of having no clear message is making the TEA PARTY a***les laugh and marginalize this momentous event
 
I just lost my whole post- I agree - there is no coherent stated goal. Yet there is, but people are like a deer in the headlights when asked what the purpose is.
I would volunteer to be a spokesman- it is obvious why we are here:
There is no more free market- it has been taken over by chains and monopolies. There is no possibility of organizing labor.
It is not conspiracy theory- there is a cabal of BANK-OIL-DEFENSE/WEAPONS-DRUGS. This is well documented. We want those responsible for the collapse held accountable. So we are demanding that justice be served in response to the irresponsable securitization of mortgages and other nefarious investment vehicles that collapsed the economoy.
Regulation- effective government, hiring only those with no conflict of interest.
Stopping the phenomena of "too big to fail" AIG types- so that we become beholden to them like idiots and bail them out. Financial industry should never include only a few large investment banks. Insurance should never be too big to fail.
Bring back industry for unskilled worker employment- otherwise tax US brands that are manufacturing overseas- GAP Nike, u name it.- it is all monopoly now.
Stop using the deficit to threaten important social nets- instead, cut defense, oil subsidizing, drug war spending.
Change the criminal justice system and the WAR ON DRUGS which is a scam used for various goals in other countries.
Stop using drugs to keep poor urban communities totally disfunctional and unable to participate as citizens.
Those are just a few reasons people are standing on Wall St. in the rain.... please! GET A CLEAR MESSAGE OUT-
Great blog/subject that absolutely has to be spread so that this can continue with a coherent mssg.
 
I am 57 years old -- not a kid (sigh.) I say that to put in context what I say next. I have been down there at the protest since the first day. The media portrays these protestors as disorganized and with no clear message. That is not true. The first day I spoke with a number of them and listened to them. I was surprised at how informed and articulate they were as to our economic situation. They are concerned about the corporate control of Congress and the media, they want the too big to fail banks broken up, and, although they are not anti-capitalism, they want a system that does not funnel all of the wealth to 1% of the population.

And, despite the lack of (1) media attention, (2) food (at times), and (3) dry bedding and clothes, they show remarkable resilience and determination. They give me some hope. I did not expect this from them because I teach law students and have been discouraged at how indifferent they are to what is happening to this country.
 
You believe it's just young people? The WaPo says it, so it's true? It's not true, there are people from all walks of life there. Cornel West was there the other day, labor unions are there today. 100 cops from the NYPD refused to go to work today to show solidarity, transit worker unions are there today. The OWS crowd marched in support of another labor union yesterday.

They've got it together, and by NOT having a concrete set of demands that can be met, they are allowing this to continue growing and changing as the situation demands.
 
I support the Occupy Wall Street youth, as at least they are willing to try and expose the system and they aren't concerned about being called racists.

If you listen to the song and read many of their writings they see themselves as the 'Digital Race', they are the generation that see each other as people and they truly seem to have transcended race identification. They are also aware of the past as many spend many hours discussing history and their new form of news based on a science that still escapes me...which I think they picked up while on Wikipedia.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XXJZ_8TLVU8
 
Oh, the 'Naked Girl' is Sonya!
 
DETAILED LIST OF DEMANDS & OVERVIEW OF TACTICS FOR DC PROTEST (compiled from suggestions made in this forum) -- Please suggest additions or edits so I can propose this list to those keeping the official one.

Read more here:
https://occupywallst.org/forum/detailed-list-of-demands-overview-of-tactics-for-d/

I believe the Children / Kids are getting their ACTIONS in order rather quickly with all their collective minds on nano activity. ;-)
 
I've been keeping up with this on Corrente. No, 'they' don' have all of their ducks in row. I bet neither did the worlds first protesters, whoever they were, but they had to cut their teeth, or get them knocked out, somewhere, sometime.

The timing is good because if this was done next year, right before the election prom, they would have been drowned out, ignored and misrepresented even moreso, with apt justification by the MSM. Failure to 'change the system' is a certainty. Tomorrow. Who knows what they'll take with them and use for the rest of their lives. Things are gonna get worse and they'll still be around.
 
Occupy Together is kind of cheesy but not the worst name.

You know what I would like to see...a network of publicity that shines the light on protests that are happening locally across the US for specific problems. They do exist, always have. But if the Occupy kids folded these protests and citizen actions into their formless protests, the benefits would be two-fold: they'd learn how to focus on a specific problem for an actual solution....and these citizens who are fighting at local municipal levels would get an infusion of attention, exposure and support.

Just to give one example....there have been dedicated people in Idaho fighting the oil companies who are bringing "megaloads" thru their state, taking over entire roads and crossing bridges not designed to hold such weight...all without state trooper escort because they don't have the manpower to dedicate to that, so damn any safety issues.

We need to spotlight these patriots, especially at a time when shiny tv ad spokesmen are speaking soothing words about tapping all those tar sands in Canada.

Google mega-loads and Idaho to see what the people in Idaho have been fighting all alone. I wouldn't mind seeing Occupy become a movement name for people like that, and others, who have been disrupting foreclosures, etc. etc.
 
"Do you really think that a headless body can spontaneously generate a brain?"

Hmmm. Government is not like a household. No more is the state like a human body. These metaphors are old and powerful, but deceptive.
 
WomanVoter: "If you listen to the song and read many of their writings they see themselves as the 'Digital Race', they are the generation that see each other as people and they truly seem to have transcended race identification."

There's the problem right there. "Digital." That just means that the NSA can and will track all of these people via Facebook, Google and their damned iPhones (which offer GPS and non-removable batteries. (Removing the battery is the only way to avoid GPS)). You prove my point: They're idiots.

"they truly seem to have transcended race identification"

If they are nattering on to each other about how virtuous they are on race, then they are prime candidates to be sidetracked by Identity politics. The attitude should be: "Fuck everything else. This is about economics, economics, economics."

The moment they say that, Bearded Hippie will show up and say: "Yeah, but don't you see? It's all connected, man! The economic part, the econological part, the spiritual part, the gender part, the racial part, the hemp legalization part..."

Bearded Hippie is THE DEVIL. Even if he is sincere, even if he is not a provocateur, he is THE DEVIL.

Economics, economics, economics. And that's it.

The economic stance must be anti-Libertarian -- using that term. Libertarianism is the enemy in this situation, the greatest enemy mankind faces, perhaps the greatest EVER faced. There can be no dialogue with Libertarians. They are the Borg. They are unredeemable evil.

From what I see, these hazy, kids are prime candidates to be misled by a charismatic YAFL. Or maybe even an old-school fascist.

I hope I'm wrong.

Just as I hoped I was wrong when I told people that Obama would be a terrible president.
 
I think Peggy Sue and Aleealee are right. This is just a kind of training ground, prelude or overture for the young people occupying Wall Street now. They'll be the ones, in years to come, who will be at the core of the real revolution.

I have to believe that or go stark staring bonkers.
 
Note: I misspelled "ecological" in the rant above.

Lambert: No metaphor ever devised has ever been exact. That's why we call them metaphors.

This particular metaphor is not about government. It's about an unorganized protest movement. "Headless body" works. "Chicken with its head cut off" might have worked better.
 
Maybe you need to get up there and offer yourself as a leader. You have the vision, the plan, and an historical perspective.
 
Me? A leader? I'd get up there and tell everyone "You're all ninnies. I hate everyone. It's all going to hell anyways." How many people would dig THAT formulation?
 
The thing this country needs most of all is new leaders to present an alternative.

We all have a responsibility to stand up and say it doesnt have to be like this.

I promise you, the alternative is the impoverishment of the country, rich and poor alike. All because of the extremes of ignorance and prejudice that this country has descended into. What I find most ironic, is that a reading of the Old Testament provides clear recommendations to avoid the current economic situation. Let he that has eyes see. So much for their interest in scripture.

And Happy New Year.

Harry
 
Joseph,

Don't get me wrong -- much of what you say is true. There is no sense in reinventing the wheel and they could learn a lot from "old hands." And, that was my initial thought. But, I really believe there has been merit in giving them some space and time to figure out some of this for themselves.

I have been surprised because your point -- that students today are ill-informed --has been demonstrated to me over and over again in conversations with many of my students. But, this group is different -- which is why perhaps they are the ones out there.

And, yes, you and I were right about Obama!
 
Back in the early 70's my backasswards state decided to hold a constitutional convention to replace the antiquated document. Before they ever even met it was obvious that the Right had out-organized the Left and any resulting document would likely try to repeal the 1st amendment to the US Constitution. In the intervening years the Right has only gotten more organized the Left has only become more expert at navel gazing.

These naifs believe they can repeat something like the Arab Spring. They're just too naive to know that the Arabs were suffering REAL repression, repression unto death. The US is just under the total control of the corporations, we likely won't die from calling Exxon a bunch of goddamned lousy motherfuckers.
 
Well, the airline pilot union has joined the kids in Occupy Wall St. Hundreds of pilots are there, in uniform! I hope the teachers join in this weekend...and then more unions, what few we have left.
 
Y'know, prowlerzee, that is one area where today's protesters have the ones from the Vietnam era beat all to hell. They've linked up with the unions.

Bless 'em for THAT.
 
I agree with you Joseph.

Before you know it there will be 9-11 truthers and other crackpots coming out of the woodwork and showing up to try to grab some of the attention.

Even without provocateurs sooner or later someone will decide to "take it to the next level." The media will cover the wrong things because the media works for TPTB.

Goals determine strategy. Strategy determines tactics.

So they are going to "Occupy Wall Street." Then what?

Massive strikes? Against who?

If they are expecting a mass uprising of the proles as the workers arise to cast off their chains they better sit down while they're waiting.
 
But then, myiq, it all comes down to Lenin's question. What, then, is to be done?

I'm starting to feel a little ashamed to be carping from the outside. Theodore Roosevelt's "In the arena" quote has come to haunt me. I have to give the kids credit for trying to do SOMETHING.

That said, the whole "Occupy" thing just seems...wrong.
 
What, then, is to be done?

Goals determine strategy. Strategy determines tactics.

The first thing is to agree on a goal.
 
1) We need new banks, or to take the existing big banks into public ownership. They need to be recapitalised and to do that they need to have the subordinated debt wiped out and the equity diluted to zero.

If we dont do that we will have a slow bleed for the next 10 years.

2) We need a commitment to a simple but PROGRESSIVE tax system. Not flat taxes.

3) We need wealth taxes, and inheritance taxes. People shouldnt be able to do nothing and collect rents on their great grandad's achievements (exploitation) in perpetuity. That is not a meritocracy.

4) We need an expanstionary monetary policy and fiscal policy. We need a better energy infrastructure, better roads, better rail, better public schools, better health care.

5) We need the bidding system for public office to end. We need crony capitalism to end. We need to drive the money out of Washington. We need to stop public offices switching backwards and forwards to the private sector to trade influence for money. We need stiff new anti-corruption laws and we need the EXISTING LAWS ENFORCED.

Hows that for an agenda?

Harry
 
I agree with Peggy Sue on this one.
I recognize all the problems inherent in this protest...but yet....

I read an interesting article by a woman involved in the Tahrir Square protests (wish I could find the link, but I’m too disorganized). The initial organizers apparently were "all the usual suspects" (i.e. sort of professional activists, most young – i.e. many fetuses). They’d attempted previous actions but hadn’t garnered much support. Apparently, someone suggested that they should take the next protest march through poor neighborhoods in Cairo – and large numbers of people started joining the march that led to all the subsequent events.

Wisconsin started small and haltingly. When the news of Walker’s bill was released, and given the substantial Republican majority in both the state legislature and state senate, most everyone felt that it was hopeless to resist. That no-one would or could resist. That the bill would pass in a few days. Then small things started happening. A bunch of members of the UW TAA (the TA union – 90% fetuses) brought heart-shaped balloons to the Capitol on Valentines Day. That gave a sense that – maybe people can do something. Spontaneous actions started happening. Each would generate a sense that maybe, just maybe, resistance was not futile. And the major protests built from that. And it was largely leaderless (though it had a clear demand – Kill The Bill). There was a people’s mike, and I was afraid that crazy people would say stupid sh*t. And occasionally that happened. But the whole thing worked. Some people in the media characterized the protests as "union organized", but for the most part that is a total misconception. The unions were involved – but it was a grassroots spontaneous uprising. And the fetuses played a crucial role in starting the resistance, as well as occupying the Capitol, which prevented it from being closed (a 22 year old is more able to endure sleeping on a cold concrete floor, while most of the "older folks" went home).

With Occupy Wall St and reading various articles by attendees – e.g. Matt Stoller’s piece
http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/09/matt-stoller-occupywallstreet-is-a-church-of-dissent-not-a-protest.html
I recognize elements in common with the Wisconsin protest – that really weren’t present in old protests I’ve been involved in (e.g. 70’s on). As noted in the comments - involvement of unions for example – which potentially can bring in a cross section of "ordinary people". And that was in part the result of outreach by the protesters (e.g. about 100 attended a protest organized by the postal worker’s union – something the postal workers hadn’t expected and which they appreciated). Also, the extreme emphasis on nonviolence is in common with WI. The attempt to reach out to the cops and maintain good relations is also in common (it appears that in NYC, the cops who ordered and carried out violent suppression were not the regular beat-cops). I’ll also note that the WI protests really made me aware of the crucial role of a "public space" for such actions (some type of continuously open public space that can serve as a base, where people can see one another and be positively reinforced and even have some fun) – in WI the Capitol served that purpose, in NYC it’s Zucotti Park/Liberty Square. And I think, potentially, a new model of protest is being created in these events.

I’m an extreme pessimist by nature, so I don’t expect much from the action in NYC...but who knows.
 
REUTERS:
Bank of America to charge debit card use fee
The comments are jolly good.
Quit. Go to a credit union. Etc.
 
What could go wrong?

Veteran agitators flock to Occupy Wall Street

The city's most experienced agitators—the labor and community groups that typically organize local marches, rallies and sit-ins—have been largely missing from the Occupy Wall Street protest that is in its 13th day at Zuccotti Park in lower Manhattan.

But that's about to change.

 
The protestors are more sophisticated than you give them credit for. According to the Daily News, they are using Vibe to protect their communications

http://www.nydailynews.com/tech_guide/2011/09/28/2011-09-28_occupy_wall_street_protesters_in_new_york_use_iphone_android_app_vibe_to_communi.html
 
You were right Joseph...the Obots are beginning to claim THEY are taking back government...with their meme. I thought they people down there were protesting Bush and Obama/Biden???

Well, Wall Street has figured out how to make it their campaign slogan, and it will be interesting when the youth catch on, as many have these Obots have the fist with the Obama logo and 2012. OK, I am feeling sick now...no one will say any thing, because if they do it is Racist. Remember when he took 'Yes We Can' from the Farm Workers?

OBAMA OCCUPY Wall Street...I thought he was woven into it already with all his corporate donors?
 
Peter, I could give you some scare stories about my credit union. Mine tried to refuse my mortgage payment once, completely illegally, and I went straight to my mayor's office and had them call one of the board members and when I went back to the CU, the president came out to take my check. Nice try at being robber barons, jerks. It gets worse...they keep trying to get my house, which still has equity in it, because they know I'm all alone here and struggling. Don't trust credit unions, even tho they are a better option than most banks. I also quit a federal credit union because they came up with sneaky ways to rob family members month after month.

Anyway! just a caveat.

I really came on to say Occupy Boston begins tonight, and I agree w/ affinis...these old bones are not fit for camping, but if the occupation here takes hold I will be taking the little ones food galore!!!
 
Joseph...also meant to say that last year the unions went to DC for that October protest.....the one that got ZERO coverage because Jon Stewart unfortunately decided to hold that phony anti-Beck Rally a couple of weeks later, and sucked all the air out of the long-planned rally to hold DC accountable.

I went, and talked to many of the people from across the country. No one, not mass media, not the blogosphere, paid it much mind. There were a few cameras there, and my sign identified me as the "Professional Leftist" that the White House sneered at...I was asked to be interviewed on camera when suddenly I was surrounded by Obots heckling me and accusing me of being "Tea Party." And in one of the only blog write-ups I saw, the hecklers were interviewed for having a "run-in with a Tea Partier."

Of course, zero mention of the teachers or other unions or why people were really there.

I hope the unions do take advantage of this rare media attention, and join on in. The spotlight will be the match on dry timber...which is exactly why we usually get media blackouts instead.
 
I forgot to note this list of potential demands:
http://nplusonemag.com/occupywallstreet
 
The key definitely is getting lots of unions strongly involved- that's what gave the backbone to the Arab Spring movements too- union workers sick and tired of what their countries were doing to the workers. Union workers might be majority middle aged folks (40's-60's), so yeah we don't have the time (work full time jobs that are crucial to our survival) or physical resilience those 20 somethings have, but we have life experience and know how direct our determination to a more defined goal. But let's not dismiss these kids, lets' jump in before those types you talked about do and misdirect these kids.
 
Oh, dammit! @Anonymous...the Obots did the same thing with the October union protest in DC last year!!!

Pretended it was their idea all along.

Maddening. Disgusting.
 
Here's a somewhat interesting article:
http://www.vancouverobserver.com/politics/commentary/2011/09/30/why-occupy-wall-street-won%E2%80%99t-die
The article's link to the dancing guy doesn't work correctly, so here's the link to that:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GA8z7f7a2Pk
And yes, there are always the risk of being co-opted in a detrimental direction...but there's also potential.
 
Some photos of the protest rally Prowlerzee refers to in his comment. That rally didn't get a lot of media attention, and seemed very "managed" by the party establishment.

October 2 Rally
http://jotman.blogspot.com/2010/10/there-live-oct-2-rally-on-mall-in.html

Here are a few photos of the other two rallies:

Sanity and/or Fear
http://jotman.blogspot.com/2010/10/live-blogging-rally-for-sanity-in.html

Glenn Beck Rally
http://jotman.blogspot.com/2010/08/live-blog-photos-glenn-beck-and.html
 
risky but i think something good could possibly happen but i also think that they were mislead into this by certain powers. conspiracy theory yes plz.
#occupywallstreet
 
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