Wednesday, January 02, 2008

Is Michael Moore even FOLLOWING politics these days?

Michael Moore has tentatively endorsed John Edwards, on the basis of Edwards' health care plan. Moore seems to be under the impression that this plan differs measurably from the ones offered by Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. It doesn't. (Arguably, Hillary's is the most left-leaning plan of the three, although that argument is considered thoughtcrime in progressiveland.)

As you know, I am an Edwards supporter myself. But that doesn't mean I am going to tolerate Moore's lies about Hillary:
I have not even touched on her other numerous -- and horrendous -- votes in the Senate, especially those that have made the middle class suffer even more
Horsefeathers.

Scroll down and you will see the post in which I talk about her voting record in detail, as Moore does not. The only legislation he mentions is the 2001 bankruptcy bill. Moore swinishly neglects to tell us that both Hillary Clinton and John Edwards voted in favor of it (to the discredit of both). Not only that. A worse version of the same bill was passed in 2000. Edwards voted for it; Bill Clinton vetoed it.

Fortunately, both Edwards and Hillary now see the error of supporting that legislation. As I document, Hillary Clinton's voting record received a 100% score from the ADA. She has compiled one of the most liberal voting records of any current Senator -- more liberal than that of John Edwards.

Moore's disconnect from reality forces me to ask: Is Michael Moore even following politics these days?

Here's the part of Moore's letter that hit me the hardest:
For months I've been wanting to ask the question, "Where are you, Al Gore?" You can only polish that Oscar for so long. And the Nobel was decided by Scandinavians! I don't blame you for not wanting to enter the viper pit again after you already won.
Disgusting! Moore himself was one of the vipers, back in 2000.

Where is Al Gore? He sure ain't in the White House, thanks in part to Moore's efforts to drum up votes for Nader back in 2000. Time to print two numbers I will never tire of repeating:

Number of people who voted for "purist" candidate Ralph Nader in Florida in 2000: 97,421

"Official" difference between the Bush vote and the Gore vote in 2000: 537.

Before proceeding, let me issue fair warning: Do not even try to foist on me the obnoxious, oft-heard lie that the Nader factor was insignificant in Florida because the Republicans controlled the voting machines. The last person who tried to sell me that falsehood was none other than Cynthia McKinney -- yes, we corresponded -- and I let her have it with both figurative barrels. She didn't have a comeback. What could she say? The facts simply do not support that position.

I probably know more about election rigging than you do, dear reader, so don't think you can take me to school. 97,000 is a lot of votes, certainly a lot more than 537. If the Republicans possessed a magic machine which could conjure up any numbers they wished, then why did they allow such a close race? Why did the Supreme Court stop the count? Why did vote caging exist at all?

(This is no longer a matter of debate, at least not on this blog. Any commenter trying to sell the cowardly canard that the Nader factor played no role in Gore's Florida loss will find his words excised on sight.)

Okay, back to Moore.

His current attitude toward Al Gore -- who would have been a great president -- stands in sharp contrast to the words he wrote to Gore in 2000:
Let's get one thing straight -- we didn't leave you, YOU left us. You and your "New Democrats" abandoned the poor, the working class, and the middle class. Your support for NAFTA has cost hundreds of thousands of people -- your very supporters -- their jobs. In my hometown of Flint, 32,000 GM jobs have been lost since you and Clinton took office.
And how is Flint doing now? Last time I looked, you could buy a house there for a few thousand dollars. How is the American economy doing now, compared to its status during the Clinton years? Is the dollar stronger or weaker? Are jobs more or less secure? Is the budget balanced? How much are we paying the Chinese to take treasury bills they no longer really want?

Another Moore letter from 2000:
If you want all the dirty money out of our elections, you HAVE to vote for Nader because he is the only one -- not Bush, not Gore -- who would eliminate it entirely. If you think the minimum wage should go up more than 50 cents an hour in the next year, then you HAVE to vote for Ralph Nader as he is only one who would raise it to a real living wage.
Yep, Al Gore was a "corporatist" taking tainted money. Sound familiar? This is the same crappy canard all Moore-ish progressives now apply to Hillary.

For a final assessment of Moore's political acumen, check out this final letter from 2000:
Come to think of it, Democrats should be on their knees thanking Ralph for running. Rather than taking votes from Gore, Ralph's going to be the one responsible for turning the House back over to the Democrats.

When millions of these Non-Voters enter that booth to vote for Ralph, and they come across their local race for Congress, they will find no Green Party candidate in most of the 435 Congressional districts. So who do you think Ralph's army of Non-Voters will plunk down for Congress? The Republican? I don't think so.
My god. What can one say about this prediction, which was laughable even on the date of issuance? What an idiot!
If you're still worried this letter might convince a weak-kneed Gore voter to flip over to Nader -- and thus lead to President George W. stacking the Supreme Court to make abortion illegal, well, it's all a bunch of hooey.
Let's have those numbers again: 97,000 vs. 537. If Nader had not run, would those 97,000 people have voted for the Republican? I don't think so. (And most of them would not have stayed home on election day.) Now let's look up the numbers of civilians killed in Iraq. Actually, we don't have hard numbers, but some estimates reach as high as 700,000 casualties. Proud of all the blood on your hands, Mr. Moore?

To recap: Moore would have us believe that Hillary Clinton -- who is not even the candidate I favor! -- has a less progressive voting record than Edwards does. Not true. And Moore would have us believe that the health care plans offered by Edwards and Clinton differ appreciably. Again: Not true. Paul Krugman -- who has actually read the plans -- considers them substantially similar.

I'll ask the question again. Is Moore even following politics these days?

11 comments:

Henry Louis Gomez said...

I'm a conservative Republican that is very interested in preserving the legitimacy of elections. I am glad to see that there are are still liberals in America that are rational. I know it's not the endorsement you want but you are correct to point out that it was Nader's supporters that spoiled the party for Gore, just as I think that Ross Perot spoiled it for George H.W. Bush.

BTW after moving to stupid electronic voting machines that could REALLY be rigged, Florida will have paper ballots that can be electronically scanned or manually counted for this upcoming election.

Anonymous said...

Yeah, pick on the fat guy.

AitchD said...

"Following politics". Cool. I'm doing it. And this is where it leads to today: On Democracy Now! Robert Parry is worrying that the Bill Clinton statement about him and Bush 41 making a goodwill tour when Hillary is POTUS really means that a Clinton WH won't hold Bush 43 accountable for his bads and worses. That's just a wild guess on Parry's part, but he padded his theory with Clintonian history between 1996 and 2000. It makes me wonder, only because I'm following politics, if anyone can be elected who will not have agreed to let bygones be bygones. I mean, if a POTUS can't trust another POTUS, who can trust anyone? But I figure, you know what? Hillary wasn't in Skull & Bones and that's probably why I still love her. I was also following politics in 2005 when Hillary spoke at (not to) the Congressional Black Caucus's Town Meeting forum, Barack Obama, Harry Belafonte, and Charles Rangel also spoke, Charles Ogeltree hosted and asked the audience what they thought about a Clinton/Obama ticket for 2008, and they cheered loudly. You know, Oprah Winfrey is maybe the most popular American person and best-liked. Some people follow politics and semiotics. Have you noticed how Hillary likes to roam the room with a hand-held mic? Don't you think, in a way, Hillary and Barack can imaginatively meld, as it were, into an Oprah projection (or is it a transference)? Amy Goodman reported that "Democrats Joe Biden, Chris Dodd, Dennis Kucinich and Mike Gravel won"t be allowed to participate in ABC’s Democratic debate on Saturday", and FOX won't allow Ron Paul and Hunter Duncan to debate with the other Republicans. Following politics includes watching the movements developing coalitions for 'alternative' candidates, especially the Paul/Kucinich movement and the Bloomberg/Hagel movement. Maybe the road to the White House will have to pass through the House of Representatives this time around.

Anonymous said...

I will never forgive that megalomaniac Ralph Nader for
his part in the election of
George Bush in 2000. I do like
Michael Moore, but I agree, his
reasoning for his political choices are dangerously silly.
For instance, that famous quote
from the Dead heroin addict (Jerry
Garcia)'the lessor of two evils
is still evil' was just stupid.
The Nader people loved to spout
that one.

Anonymous said...

Christ, you guys are unreal.

This is America and anyone can run for president. That doesn't spoil it for anyone, except in the minds of those hopelessly lost in their own fantasies. Apparently I know more about the elections than anyone here.

Somebody won, somebody lost. Somebody miscounted, somebody cheated, someone got cheated. The miscounting affected whatever the terrain happened to be at the time. (end of story).

And, by the way... if America had voted Bush in, fair and square, (in either 2000 or '04) I would have been behind his presidency 100% (while still being horrified at his decisions and policies). However, that isn't what happened, now is it? And, like this oft-misguided entrepreneur we have as a commentator here, my ire is directed at the machinations and persons that allow these things to go unchallenged, moreso than at the actual perpetrators.

Democracy will always take hits and tests. We're supposed to survive them by being vigilant. We've seen that it can fail.

Anonymous said...

You said: "Why did the Supreme Court stop the count? Why did vote caging exist at all?"

These are EXCELLENT questions regarding 2000. They stopped the count because W was going to lose (as the media recount(s) showed). Vote caging exists for the same reason "spoiled/soiled" ballots exist; for the same reason voter intimidation exists; for the same reason felon disenfranchisement exists - to suppress the minority vote. These are all traced back to the Mississippi Constitution of 1890, a plan to get black voters off the rolls.

As for 2004, as you were kind enough to cover so well, it's all an Urban Legend!

Joseph Cannon said...

Thanks for the history lesson, Michael. And yet, forgive me, but you seem to be intentionally missing the point.

My point concerns the impact of Nader on the Florida vote.

A lot of progressives want to believe that Nader was an insignificant factor. This is just wrong. Without Nader, there would have been no W presidency.

Look, let's concede everything that you and Greg Palast and everyone else has to say about vote caging and all the other atrocious tricks played by the Republicans in 2000.

Hell, let's take it further, at least hypothetically. Let's say, for the sake of illustration, that the Republicans held 200,000 elderly Democrats at gunpoint and prevented them from heading to the election booth.

Even if THAT were true, the two numbers I cited would not change:

Number of people who voted for "purist" candidate Ralph Nader in Florida in 2000: 97,421

"Official" difference between the Bush vote and the Gore vote in 2000: 537

Basic math: 97,000 > 537.

97,000. 537. Those are the key numbers. And those two numbers simply DO NOT CHANGE, no matter what malfeasance was going on elsewhere.

Moore played "John the Baptist" to Nader. Nader caused the election of George Bush. Without Nader, there would have been no Iraq war, no subprime crisis, no massive deficit, no torture, none of it.

I know progressives do not want to admit the extent of the damage they wrought by calling Gore a "corporatist" in 2000. But that vile canard is precisely what brought us Bush and Cheney.

That is a fact.

Fact. Incontrovertible fact.

FACT FACT FACT FACT FUCKING FACT FACTFACTFACT!FACT!FACT!!FACT!!

And I am never going to allow you to forget it.

Anonymous said...
This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.
Joseph Cannon said...

anon: As the talking skull says in the Disneyland ride -- "Fairly warned be ye, says I."

Anonymous said...

Jos. Of course Nader cost Gore Florida, even with all the cheating. I think Nader was full of b.s on NH in 2004 also. I have problems with his protest and the weak case presented after he, Nader, demanded a recount. He's all about Nader. So there's nothing I've forgotten. I was amplifying on what I thought were excellent two excellent questions presented in your article.

Cheers

Anonymous said...

Politics = voting for the lesser of two evils. (inferred from above)

Moore was only being true to himself, I guess you have a problem with that.

Most of the Democrat AND Republican choices we have been given over the last 20 years have been people that Moore naturally must hate, which is those that do the bidding of the corporate masters. Nader was clearly the non-corporate choice in 2000, Perot was in '92 & '96.

This year, a vote for Hillary or a vote for Giuliani, Romney or McCain will be a vote for the status quo. They will only produce more problems for the people of this country - the problems that give Moore so much motivation to make his movies.